GameSlice Interview

By Geoff Keighley

November 24, 1996

The Larry's collector edition is called his "Greatest Hits and Misses." Which Larry game was the greatest hit and which was the greatest miss in your mind, not counting true sales? And no, Larry 4 can't be the greatest miss <g>.

Larry considers Passionate Patti to be his greatest miss, but of course that’s just his opinion! So you think the collection’s title referred to the games? HA! It’s about the women, Geoff...it’s always about the women!

But, if you’re asking me which Larry game is most disappointing, I’d have to say Larry 5. I thought at the time people wanted to watch movies, and so I tried to make it less interactive. In hindsight, I was obviously wrong, but at the time I thought it was a way to bring more people into the “adventure game tent.” I quickly realized, if people want to sit back and watch movies, they’ll rent a videotape. People buy games for interactivity, so I returned to that with Larry 6.

Have you ever thought of putting Larry in a pair of blue jeans or at least updating his look? How about Larry with a beard?

Larry in blue jeans? Blasphemy! Larry may not know much, but he knows who he is and what he believes in! You’ll never see it happen. (On the other hand, it’s a well-known fact that beards are a sign of virility and intelligence...just see my photo.)

The interface you chose to use for Larry 7 is a unique mix between icons and text parser. Did you decide to use this interface because you were never really happy with the way icon adventure games played?

Icons were a product of the times, just as Love for Sail!’s interface is. Back then, paint programs let users select tools from palettes, then use that tool on their work. Now programs are more context sensitive; menus appear that eliminate all the wrong answers. I felt it was time for games to do the same.

In addition, the icons limited me to trree or four choices (that zipper icon was never really a satisfactory substitute, was it?). Written languages replaced iconic languages a few millennia ago because they allow more flexible expression.

Larry 6 did icons as well as I can do them. I was disappointed with the simplicity of pure “point-and-click” when I did Torin's Passage. It eliminated the surprise and depth of humor inherent in multiple, continually-changing choices.

There's a lot of talk in the industry about where adventure games are going. The simple fact is that the market isn't growing as fast as action games. Why do you think this is the case?

Let’s see now...sit and think or run and gun? Which is better? Which is more popular?

The truth is there’s room for both in movies and books, and there’s also room for both in gaming. Many people love to spend hours working out a mental puzzle to make progress through a plot. Others love to spend hours working out how to kill the bad guys to get through a level. In both cases, you pick the entertainment you enjoy. My hope is action gamers will discover the joy of humor and satisfaction that’s in my games.

As one of the best adventure game designers, do you think consumers no longer want a 60 hour quest, but rather a whole wad of smaller adventures which can be played in one sitting? Do players want a certain sense of accomplishment every time they "boot up?"

Repeat the first part of the question again, will you? <G> Thanks for saying that, although it’s hard for me to accept. I just write games that I enjoy playing. When others laugh too, that makes it all the better.

To answer your question, I think the cluster of small quests has been one of my major discoveries. All my recent games are structured so they are not 60 hours in pursuit of a long-term goal, but rather a series of mini-goals that can provide satisfaction along the way to the ultimate goal.

I consciously tried to make Larry 6 and 7 as “round” as possible. By “round” I mean you can go almost anywhere and solve the puzzles in almost any order. That makes it difficult for me to create character or plot development, but I find it more satisfying to play.

Freddy Pharkas, Frontier Pharmacist was my attempt to prove an adventure game could reveal character development. Freddy changes personality throughout the game. But that was only possible because the major puzzles were presented in a fixed order, strung like beads on a string. You had to finish one to learn the next.

If you played Freddy and didn’t notice that, then I consider my design a success. Gamers should never be able to see the “mechanics” of the game, plot, or characters. If they can, I didn’t do my job.

In five years from now, how will an adventure game look and play? Will Larry be battling monster-babes in a 3D dungeon?

If you had asked me five years ago (which was right after Larry 5) what Larry 7 would be like, I would have had no idea. Could I have predicted the look and feel of Love for Sail!? Of course not. Because if I had, I wouldn’t have waited until now to do it!

So where will Larry be in five years? I have no idea, but if he’s battling monsters in a dungeon (even monster babes in 3-D dungeons), I’ll be damned surprised!

Speaking of the future, I know MASK OF ENTERNITY: KING'S QUEST 8 revolves around a 3D true-space world. For the next Larry adventure, can we expect Larry to be a polygon character lurking through 3D environments?

A 3-D Larry would be easy. It’s those 3-D women that are the challenge! Perhaps we’ll do a hybrid game or a first person game or...well, if you’ve seen the ending of Larry 7, you know I’m leaving my future possibilities wide open! (And if you haven’t seen it, you should! Stick around through the credits.)

Al, why the Laffer Utilities? Do you think anyone actually used the "Places to Eat Lunch Database?"

The Laffer Utilities was a great idea, I was just three years ahead of my time! For those unsuspecting gamers who have no idea of what we speak, The Laffer Utilities was a collection of 18 goofy little programs for “all the things you do at the office that have nothing to do with work.”

Now may be too late. The Internet does it!

Over the past few years you've designed games such as Freddy Pharkas and Torin's Passage, but they certainly haven't caught on the way Larry has. Why?

It’s simple. I purposely sabotaged the design of those games so they wouldn’t compete with Larry’s great success! <G>

Hell, I don’t know! If I did, I’d have written Myst! Every time I finish a game, I ask myself “what do people want next?” and its corollary, “how can I do that making use of my sense of humor?”

Obviously, Sierra and I believe in humor titles. But you have to admit: Larry has built a huge following over the course of 10 years, and it’s tough to do that without sequels. Both of the games you mention have sold well and would be considered giant hits by many publishers. But Larry appeals to nearly everyone, probably because most men are interested in women and most women enjoy laughing at men!

So, do you think some of your critics are justified when they say it's the sex, not the game design that sells Larry titles?

Of course, but they’re wrong, you know. The games don’t really have much sex, as everyone who has played one knows. Besides, the promise of sex is better

But then, leaf through a magazine or turn on the TV. Count the number of sexual references in advertising, or story lines, and everything else. To a great extent, that’s what I’m parodying in Larry; at least, to the extent that I’m not using it! <G>

We know there are surely a whole bunch of hidden easter eggs in Larry 7. Can you maybe divulge one to our readers?

What?! There are?! No, there can’t be! I’m shocked! Shocked, I tell you! I took such care to check the game for any such hidden content! (Of course, I was out of the country for the last few weeks of coding...but, no!) It can’t be true.

I’m sure Don removed that “push” on the branch feature from Drew’s close-up. At least, he said he did. And Steve promised me he’d fix that bug where you actually see the Juggs applying hair spray...

Out of all the babes Larry has encountered over the years, do you have a favorite? Why?

Passionate Patti is my favorite. She’s a musician, hip, worldly, open with her sexuality, and a real looker. I made her everything Larry isn’t! You might just hear from her in a future game.

I know one of your dreams has been to go on Letterman and promote Larry. Is it ever going to happen?

I’m sure it will. I’m just waiting for his people to contact my people. But since I don’t have any people...

As we mentioned before, Sierra has lost a lot of fans of their adventure games over the past 3 or 4 years. Now with Larry 7 released, what can you say to them that will want to make them give Sierra and the Larry series another chance?

Love for Sail! combines the best of the old adventure games with some new ideas that make it even more fun to play. You’ll find the complex puzzles you enjoyed so much, extended game play, plus all the old smart-ass responses you used to laugh at when you typed in wrong things. But, we’ve eliminated the “walking around” that slowed game play and added little to the gaming experience. I think Larry 7 has the best gameplay of the series. And it’s surely the funniest!

At one point we had heard about Jon Lovitz in a Larry movie. Is that project still in development?

Yeah, I heard that too, but it never got past the rumor stage. But right now, one of those famous “major Hollywood studios” actually has an option for a live-action Larry movie. I know they’ve developed several scripts, but nothing’s happened so far. I’ll believe it when I see the check! <G>

I've always admired many of the interesting gameplay features you often add to your games, and I know your dream of having the player's face in a game has finally come true in Larry 7. Do you still want to further expand upon the notion of making the player an interactive part of the game? How so?

I believe people really want to see themselves on screen. I always have and I think I’m typical. (Well, in that respect.) So, when you play Larry 7 and see my ugly puss, remember that could be your ugly puss instead!

Someday we’ll have graphics sophisticated and powerful enough to really let people be the star of their games. For now, we’re making our feeble first steps. But, give us credit for starting.

LucasArts, famous for games such as Day of the Tentacle and Monkey Island, hasn't released an adventure game in a long time, although I think their games are absolutely wonderful. Do you think their games are well produced? Do they make better adventures than Sierra? Why or why not?

Speaking as a gamer, I too miss their games. Speaking as a game designer, I think they do way too many! <grin> Better? No. Different? Yes. Fun? Yep. Why? Because their games aren’t by me! <g,d&r>

So, are you heading right into designing another Larry project now, or starting work on a new game?

My immediate goal is detox! After a long season of “crunch mode” (which seems to be the only way these projects get done on time!), I’ve learned I must take time off to recharge my creative battery. I’ll read all those magazines I’ve piled up, play all those games I’ve been waiting to play, and try to figure out what gamers like you would enjoy seeing. In a month or two, I’ll be back in the thick of things.

Do you ever think of putting the Larry series to rest because you don't want to spoil too much of a good thing -- i. e. you'd rather stop the series while it is still hot?

Spoil a good thing? It’s too late for that! <grin> Hell, anyone who’s played my games knows my favorite rule: anything worth doing is worth over-doing!

Will my next project be a Larry? That depends upon you gamers. If Love for Sail! doesn’t sell, if it’s panned by reviewers, if players hate it...well, that’ll be the end of Larry Laffer.

But if early indications are right, it looks like people are having as much fun playing this game as we did creating it! Therefore, I suspect we’ll be having this conversation again, in a year or two.

Finally, since you're a comedic kind of guy, what's the funniest joke you've ever heard? And yes, Junior is in the room, so play nice.

Well, since Junior’s here... No, seriously, asking me for my funniest joke is like asking a painter for his most beautiful sunset, or a composer for his best song. I can’t! Besides, reading a joke is never as good as hearing one. So, here’s my answer: play Love for Sail! and check out my audio-animatronic stand-up comedian Willy in “Great Moments with Mr. Clinton.” I gave him 75 of the best jokes I know! And if you consider that a cop-out...it is! <grin>

It’s been great chatting with you, Geoff. And I hope everyone here gets a chance to play Love for Sail! It’s the funniest Larry yet!